Gen 2 M12 drill weight

I’m thinking of selling my faulty Makita subcompact 18V drill and buying into M12 for the new Gen 2 drill (and bonus to have the dual charger for future M18 purchases). 

There’s no way I want the drill to be heavier than the Makita, it’s role is light duty. The size looks great but I read it’s weight is 1.4Kg!

The Dewalt DCD796 18V hammer drill is only 1.6Kg with battery and the subcompact 18V Makita with battery is 1.3Kg. 

Are Milwaukee weight specs usually including battery weight? I hope I’ve read a figure that includes the large 6.0ah 6 cell battery. Still, that’s heavy. 

Weight has pretty much been the only thing that has kept me away from buying Milwaukee. I can’t recall ever seeing one of their cordless tools being the lightest in comparisons. 

Hopefully someone can shed some light on this, the Gen 2 looks great otherwise. 

Edit: I just read on coptool it is 1.27kg including battery. 

I think Milwaukee is inconsistent on the weighing process. I’ve never handled the m12 Fuel drill/driver but Milwaukee lists it as being heavier than the hammer version…which seems backwards.

I haven’t held the gen 2 yet but if it’s 1.27kg with battery, that is amazing. That’s the same weight as the Makita, which was noticeably lighter and smaller than the gen 1 Fuel.

BTW 1.27kg is 2.8lbs.

Yeah sorry about the metric, I was in a hurry and couldn’t provide both units. 

A good thing about Metabo is they always state after weight “(incl battery)”. Its not perfect because they don’t say what battery exactly; could be compact 2ah, 5.2ah, 7ah LiHD, who knows. I usually assume it’s the battery shown in the photo. 

D W wrote:

9 hours ago, D W said:

Yeah sorry about the metric, I was in a hurry and couldn’t provide both units. 

 

A good thing about Metabo is they always state after weight “(incl battery)”. Its not perfect because they don’t say what battery exactly; could be compact 2ah, 5.2ah, 7ah LiHD, who knows. I usually assume it’s the battery shown in the photo. 

 

 

 

Us Americans need to learn the metric system anyway, especially if you’re into German tools like I am!

I wish there was a norm; this is how we measure torque, this is weight. Weight listed as bare tools, all batteries have a weight listed.

BMack37 wrote:

3 hours ago, BMack37 said:

 

Us Americans need to learn the metric system anyway, especially if you’re into German tools like I am!

 

I wish there was a norm; this is how we measure torque, this is weight. Weight listed as bare tools, all batteries have a weight listed.

Hey, I remember when I was a wee lil squirt and Carter was saying we’d be metric likity split. I wish we were metric.

Would save so much money for mechanics. If we had converted by then most cars would be all metric now except for the “classics”

I remember when I was young, there was the half assed attempt to switch over to metric.  Apparently that’s why we have soda in two liter bottles. 

I’ve been thinking of changing to metric in wood working…I’d have to replace all my layout tools though. I only have two tape measures that have metric…then you really can’t get metric drill bits in the US.

I just got a gen2 kit and they do have good balance but are on the heavy side for their size. Nothing like a makita design. I guess it’s the trade off for the speed and power and the fulll set of controls and features. I still prefer my Bosch 12v being smaller and lighter tools but these do have a place if you almost need 18v speed or power and don’t mind fat handles. If you’re coming from makita, you’ll most likely think these are too heavy in relation to the size and power. I only own the makita 18v xdt14 impact but it’s a smaller impact head and I don’t know the weight but withe the light weight and good balance in hand it feels lighter than the m12 impact. The m12 feels smaller only if the 3 cell batteries are used. It’s nowhere near as fast under load as the makita. My smallest 18v drill is a Bosch DDS183 and I use it more than even the Bosch 12v drill for extensive work. It has more to do with he ergonomics of the tool handle for me. 

Great to hear some real feedback about the weight @XTsallaD. I suspected it was going to be kinda heavy (for a 12V).

I’ve seen one review where they compared the M12 drill to the brushed Bosch 12V flexiclick drill. They kept stating how the M12 is more powerful and more compact (length) but seemed to miss mentioning the weight. Nothing seems to beat Bosch 12V in weight (I’ve owned the ps31 drill driver and have a ps22 on its way).

It has an all metal chuck and that metal shell is heavy compared to the plastic shell on the Bosch and Makita. The Bosch 12v is tiny in comparison, the motor on the M12 Fuel has to be 20% larger or more! Also I think the Bosch has a 3/8″ chuck.

I wish Milwaukee would stop making the M12 brushed drill and replace it with a compact, lightweight drill…smaller motor, plastic shelled chuck(though the 3/8″ chuck already weighs less than the 1/2″ Fuel chuck). I’m really close to buying into the Bosch 12v line for the size.

Yep, the Bosch is a 3/8 chuck.

Good idea @BMack37, it would be great to have a compact M12 option available as well. I chose Bosch 12V over M12 largely because of the size. If the Gen 2 was out at the time, it would have been harder to chose, but it was a simple choice with the HUGE Gen 1.

I ended up selling my brushed ps31 Bosch 12V drill purely because it didn’t have a belt clip and couldn’t really stand on the battery. I replaced it with a Makita subcompact. I really should have just glued a piece of perspex to the bottom of the battery so it could stand (which would avoid having the extra weight of the flat bottom 4ah battery).

Maybe I’ll look into the brushless ps32 Bosch 12V drill now that the Makita is playing up. I was really hoping the Gen 2 M12 would “feel” more like a compact than it probably does. I won’t write it off yet though, until I see it in person somewhere.

D W wrote:

6 hours ago, D W said:

Yep, the Bosch is a 3/8 chuck.

 

Good idea @BMack37, it would be great to have a compact M12 option available as well. I chose Bosch 12V over M12 largely because of the size. If the Gen 2 was out at the time, it would have been harder to chose, but it was a simple choice with the HUGE Gen 1.

 

I ended up selling my brushed ps31 Bosch 12V drill purely because it didn’t have a belt clip and couldn’t really stand on the battery. I replaced it with a Makita subcompact. I really should have just glued a piece of perspex to the bottom of the battery so it could stand (which would avoid having the extra weight of the flat bottom 4ah battery).

 

Maybe I’ll look into the brushless ps32 Bosch 12V drill now that the Makita is playing up. I was really hoping the Gen 2 M12 would “feel” more like a compact than it probably does. I won’t write it off yet though, until I see it in person somewhere.

The lack of a belt clip and a place to put the belt clip on the other side(to put or fabricate a bit holder) is why I haven’t already bought the Bosch. I have one side job of warranting TVs. I ONLY bring my M12 Fuel Drill, if I hook it to my belt I can carry the TV and my clipboard. Normally it’s just on a stand so it’s 4 PH2 screws and light torque…that’s a lot of drill to tote around for that. Without being able to hold it in my hands, I either carry two drills in my car or carry the Bosch gangsta style

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I considered using a drill holster, but I don’t always have a belt on and sometimes I just like to pick it up and go. 

I’ve recently ordered the brushless Bosch ps22 hex driver (below). I do a lot of small screws, putting up blinds etc. It’s probably perfect for the TV jobs @BMack37. It’s only 0.98Kg (2.1lbs) with battery! Super compact. There’s a couple of nice photos in an old for sale post by @ChrisK here:

I’d love to see Milwaukee bring something like this out in Gen 2 form. I never used to see the value of having a hex driver. It just seems so convenient now. 

D W wrote:

23 hours ago, D W said:

I considered using a drill holster, but I don’t always have a belt on and sometimes I just like to pick it up and go. 

 

I’ve recently ordered the brushless Bosch ps22 hex driver (below). I do a lot of small screws, putting up blinds etc. It’s probably perfect for the TV jobs @BMack37. It’s only 0.98Kg (2.1lbs) with battery! Super compact. There’s a couple of nice photos in an old for sale post by @ChrisK here:

 

 

 

I’d love to see Milwaukee bring something like this out in Gen 2 form. I never used to see the value of having a hex driver. It just seems so convenient now. 

 

 

 

 

 

I imagine you’ll really like that ps22. That will stand on it’s battery for you. I bought a reconditioned one a while back and it is my most used tool in my kit ever since I got it. I’m waiting for Milwaukee to make a hex chuck on the gen 2 format with the electronic clutch as well. I favor hex chuck drivers for a drill driver with a clutch but most are 12v. I think bosch make one but it’s not available in the us. Metabo makes a drill with both types of chuck and the 3 jaw is removeable. I did get a Hilti 12v hex chuck driver this past year. I like it a lot. It is brushed but is very quiet. More quiet than the ps22 but not as much torque.  It has a slide pack style battery so the handle is really nicely shaped. You can sort of see the Hilti in one pic and there’s a pic with the ps32 next to the gen2 fuel. 

I was kicking myself for not getting that when Chris sold it…now I’m kicking myself again haha.

@XTsallaD thanks for the photos. The Gen 2 fuel looks HUGE compared to the Bosch. I’m surprised it’s still that much bigger actually! The Gen 1 must be monstrous. 

I really like the Bosch 18V in the photo (DDS183?). If I didn’t have a Dewalt DCD796 I’d be aiming for one of those for sure. 

Looking forward to the ps22. I use the subcompact Makita now, but I don’t need all that power for driving. I rarely go beyond 10 on the clutch. 12V will be perfect. 

D W wrote:

8 hours ago, D W said:

@XTsallaD thanks for the photos. The Gen 2 fuel looks HUGE compared to the Bosch. I’m surprised it’s still that much bigger actually! The Gen 1 must be monstrous. 

 

I really like the Bosch 18V in the photo (DDS183?). If I didn’t have a Dewalt DCD796 I’d be aiming for one of those for sure. 

 

Looking forward to the ps22. I use the subcompact Makita now, but I don’t need all that power for driving. I rarely go beyond 10 on the clutch. 12V will be perfect. 

Good eye, yes that’s the dds183. Spins fast and has a really nice electronic clutch. It also has a mechanical clutch which makes it feel really crisp and consistent. It will click once or maybe twice and the power will suddenly stop. It’s not very loud when the mechanical slips and it only clicks once or twice depending on how fast it’s spinning and how high of a setting. The new handle shape is as small and comfortable as dewalt’s But shaped differently. 

The image of the m12 can be a little deceitful since the camera is so close and the chuck of the m12 is so large. Attached is a better representation but is from a higher angle and there’s still parallax happening. One point of reference would be that the back end of both of the driver bodies are about the same height or just a few mm higher than the bosch (~5 mm on the drill and the impact ~2mm). The m12 have a much longer handle and much more angle in relation to head and handle, which feels really nice in most scenarios. 

I know this sounds wierd but the belt hooks on the gen 2 Milwaukees are the best Ive had on a drill and impact. Its placed near its center of gravity, so when im going up or down a ladder it doesn’t swing all over the place. Its a low-key improvement that i really appreciate. 

got the gen2 fuel today . ordered then non hammer  set as i hoped the non hammer chuck will give more precision , and maybe also save some weight .

the drill (2503-20) weights 1.056Kg (yes metric!) bare tool.

1.238Kg with the small 2Ah battery .

i dont mind the weight , but the handle felt very strange at first . its fat at the bottom section , fatter then my m18 tools , even the big impact wrench which is very weird  .i guess its due to their  m12 battery design , which has unnecessary bulk built into it .

after some use i got over it and dont care about it much .

noccem wrote:

I know this sounds wierd but the belt hooks on the gen 2 Milwaukees are the best Ive had on a drill and impact. Its placed near its center of gravity, so when im going up or down a ladder it doesn’t swing all over the place. Its a low-key improvement that i really appreciate. 

sss wrote:

got the gen2 fuel today . ordered then non hammer  set as i hoped the non hammer chuck will give more precision , and maybe also save some weight .
the drill (2503-20) weights 1.056Kg (yes metric!) bare tool.
1.238Kg with the small 2Ah battery .
 
i dont mind the weight , but the handle felt very strange at first . its fat at the bottom section , fatter then my m18 tools , even the big impact wrench which is very weird  .i guess its due to their  m12 battery design , which has unnecessary bulk built into it .
after some use i got over it and dont care about it much .
                                                                                                                                                                                           
 

D W wrote:

I considered using a drill holster, but I don’t always have a belt on and sometimes I just like to pick it up and go. 
 
I’ve recently ordered the brushless Bosch ps22 hex driver (below). I do a lot of small screws, putting up blinds etc. It’s probably perfect for the TV jobs [mention=51872]BMack37[/mention]. It’s only 0.98Kg (2.1lbs) with battery! Super compact. There’s a couple of nice photos in an old for sale post by [mention=2255]ChrisK[/mention] here:
 
 
 
I’d love to see Milwaukee bring something like this out in Gen 2 form. I never used to see the value of having a hex driver. It just seems so convenient now. 
 
 
 
 
 

I absolutely love my Bosch 12v tools. The ergonomics are spot on. Size is small and light. I have the new M12 FUEL tools and the drill is bulky, albeit powerful. The impact is much better, more Bosch sized.

I went one step ahead and created the ultimate Bosch 12v FlexiClick out of a Ps32.

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The.Handyman wrote:

I absolutely love my Bosch 12v tools. The ergonomics are spot on. Size is small and light. I have the new M12 FUEL tools and the drill is bulky, albeit powerful. The impact is much better, more Bosch sized.

I went one step ahead and created the ultimate Bosch 12v FlexiClick out of a Ps32.

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isaiahb85 wrote:

Very nice. I love it!

I might tackle that myself soon. I already have both drills.

Any tips or pointers?

The.Handyman wrote:

1 hour ago, The.Handyman said:

I absolutely love my Bosch 12v tools. The ergonomics are spot on. Size is small and light. I have the new M12 FUEL tools and the drill is bulky, albeit powerful. The impact is much better, more Bosch sized.

I went one step ahead and created the ultimate Bosch 12v FlexiClick out of a Ps32.

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Forgive the ignorance, but why would you do this? What makes the PS32 body better than the flexi click?

khariV wrote:

 
Forgive the ignorance, but why would you do this? What makes the PS32 body better than the flexi click?

Thanks @The.Handyman thats a great idea. Nicely done. You’ve created the ultimate 12V tool. 

I plan on getting the new m12 drill here shortly but I can’t help but notice how they uglied up these drills and changed the rubber over mold on the back of the drill. Maybe it looks better in person but from here it’s ugly

That is an awesome conversion!

The ps22 has arrived already. Wow, I can’t believe how light it is! Seriously surprised me. The brushed 12V drill felt a lot heavier than this (from memory). It is a bit top heavy which I expected, and the LED kinda sucks. It’s been a while since I’ve held a Bosch 12V so I have to get used to the fat grip again.

This thing is impressive though. The usual Bosch high quality feel and smooth running. Definitely the lightest power tool I own now. 

I’d really like to know what the Makita 12V hex driver is like. If you remove the chuck from the subcompact, that’s how short it is. 

D W wrote:

On 2/8/2018 at 11:59 PM, D W said:

The ps22 has arrived already. Wow, I can’t believe how light it is! Seriously surprised me. The brushed 12V drill felt a lot heavier than this (from memory). It is a bit top heavy which I expected, and the LED kinda sucks. It’s been a while since I’ve held a Bosch 12V so I have to get used to the fat grip again.

 

This thing is impressive though. The usual Bosch high quality feel and smooth running. Definitely the lightest power tool I own now. 

 

I’d really like to know what the Makita 12V hex driver is like. If you remove the chuck from the subcompact, that’s how short it is. 

 

 

 

I’d buy into the Mak 12v line just for this tool if it is ever offered in North America 

The.Handyman wrote:

On 2/8/2018 at 9:24 AM, The.Handyman said:

I absolutely love my Bosch 12v tools. The ergonomics are spot on. Size is small and light. I have the new M12 FUEL tools and the drill is bulky, albeit powerful. The impact is much better, more Bosch sized.

I went one step ahead and created the ultimate Bosch 12v FlexiClick out of a Ps32.

[External image (uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com), not copied][External image (uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com), not copied][External image (uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com), not copied][External image (uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com), not copied][External image (uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com), not copied][External image (uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com), not copied]

This is amazing! Well done! I’d happily void my warranty to do this without a second thought. 

The.Handyman wrote:

On 2/8/2018 at 9:59 AM, The.Handyman said:

Super easy, just take apart and switch front assembly. Slips right off and on the motor drive gear.

Easy peasy

I’ve been curious about installing a hex chuck onto the gen2 m12 fuel drill. Do you happen to know a solution for that?? 

I’m realizing that the gen2 12v fuel head size, although very compact is’n really more compact than my 18v bosch dds183 drill. Maybe a couple mm shorter if that. I only have a pic of the 18v with bosch’s 12v as my gen2 m12 is out on a job. The head sizes of the bosch 18v and the gen2 m12 are almost identical and of course the bosch is faster and has more torque. I also think the bosch electronic clutch is far better and the anti-kickback feature on the bosch is great. It is a little heavier than the gen2 m12 and far more bulky at the 18v battery area. For all day extended use the super ergonomic handle and performance of the bosch dds183 is preferable for me, even with the extra weight. 

On my 7 hour trip across to Sydney today I popped in to a Mitre 10 store and was able to see the Makita 12V in person for the first time. They look to be very good tools! I thought the grips might have been smaller than the 18V subcompact but they seem identical. Very comfortable. They were fixed to the shelf so I didn’t have a chance to assess the weight. 

The hex driver is very compact but feels larger than the Bosch because it’s so tall. 

Perhaps Makita will become the best 12V line if they produce enough tools. 

Here are some size comparisons with the gen2 m12 tools. The drill with the Bosch dds183 and the impact with the Makita xdt14.

That DDS183 is compact! 

The respective websites for Milwaukee and Bosch state the weights of the tools with the bare Bosch and Bosch with 2.0 slim pack as heavier than the m12. I wish I had a scale that I don’t have to plug into my wife’s computer to use. I’ll weigh them some day but to me the 18v Bosch actually feels a bit lighter. I know balance has a lot to do with it but if I close my eyes and pick them up by the top, m12 feels obviously heavier. I really like both and am surprised at the size, speed and power from both the dds183 and the m12.  dds183 has antikickback tech, and for good reason, in my opinion. 

I had a good look at some of the M12 range in person today and I definitely won’t be buying into the line-up anymore.

They’re just not compact. The grips in particular are huge compared to the Bosch 12V.

I was really hoping I’d like them; on paper the M12 line up looks great. 

There are exactly 2 things I want on the M12 lineup:

the new soldering iron

the shameless dremel knockoff

Both are items I’m hard-pressed to see Makita offering competition for now that they’ve moved away from pod-style batteries. I don’t see anyone else doing it either. Same time there are a number of complaints about the sturdiness of the M12 “Dremel” and the soldering iron is annoying trying to get ahold of. It’s *just* irritating enough that I keep falling just shy of pulling the trigger.

After that though I agree with you. M12 is solid in absolute terms, frequently much stronger than other 12V from competitors,  but it gets to the point where it’s too similar to Milwaukee’s own 18V line, in which case just get the 18V which are just better with a much broader product base to boot.

ToolBane wrote:

2 hours ago, ToolBane said:

things I want on the M12 lineup:

 

the new soldering iron

the shameless dremel knockoff

I feel the same way, both would be great 12V tools. I wanted that soldering iron. I’m also looking for a rotary tool but I’ve always had Bosch 12V in mind for that. I would have liked the M12 caulking gun as well. 

Here’s some photos from an ebay auction. Look at the size of that grip! 

thats the gen 1 drill. I heard somewhere that the gen 2 is a little thicker in the handle too

The thick handles are almost obligatory with the pod-style batteries, and they feel cumbersome and awkward in comparison to the slick ergonomics of slide-pack batteries whether 12 or 18 volt. Makita’s older 12V that used pods have that same nuisance form-factor…looks cute in pictures but then you hold it in your hand. Makita ditching the pod-style batteries will probably prove to be the right choice for almost all the 12V tools they decide to make going forward.

Pod-style is perfect for Milwaukee’s Dremel clone and soldering iron though. I guess I’ll probably get them whenever Home Despot finally has them both available for in-store pickup. They sure seem to want to avoid giving me what I want though.

A tools grip can be a pretty subjective thing because everybody has different sized hands along with different applications.  I personally found the very first brushed m12 tools to have fat grips but their new stuff fits my hand almost perfectly.  Now I would say I have slightly larger than average hands but the way grip tappers behind the trigger makes it sit in my hand nice and tight.  Yes the bottom of the handle is bigger but its still much more compact than a slide type battery (not talking about the m12 larger xc batteries). 

Biggie wrote:

3 hours ago, Biggie said:

A tools grip can be a pretty subjective thing because everybody has different sized hands along with different applications.  I personally found the very first brushed m12 tools to have fat grips but their new stuff fits my hand almost perfectly.  Now I would say I have slightly larger than average hands but the way grip tappers behind the trigger makes it sit in my hand nice and tight.  Yes the bottom of the handle is bigger but its still much more compact than a slide type battery (not talking about the m12 larger xc batteries). 

True, for me I preferred the grip on the gen1 fuel m12. The gen2 is wider at the top between thumb and index. The gen1 felt decent in my hand but the drill was too large overall. I also feel like, if going slide pack, go 18v. For 12v the fatter handles are worth it for overall compactness.  I can fit a fat handled 12v tool in a backpack kit far easier than an 18v tool and I can perform 95% of the work I may do in a high rise and I don’t have to wait on the service elevator. I can also fly easier with the same compact kit using 12v. 

I’ve always had a bit of a problem with the Bosch 12V grips. It’s not the thickness, it’s the trigger sitting too low. When the back of my hand is tucked right up into the back of the grip (as it should be), my index finger naturally ends up over the LED light (with middle finger ending up over the trigger), so I have to either try and reach down to the trigger with my index finger, use my middle finger for the trigger, or try not to hold the drill at the very top of the grip.

XTsallaD wrote:

42 minutes ago, XTsallaD said:

if going slide pack, go 18v. For 12v the fatter handles are worth it for overall compactness.  I can fit a fat handled 12v tool in a backpack kit far easier than an 18v tool

I feel the same way.

The Makita 18V subcompact line is compact, but nothing like the Bosch 12V. Seeing them side-by-side in the photos I posted above actually makes the subcompact look big (and not many tools would do that)! The entire footprint of the tools are so much smaller without the slide packs hanging off them.

The new 12V Makita do feel compact, but also nothing like Bosch 12V. I’m pretty sure the tools are identical to the 18V subcompacts, so you only save on the size and weight of two 18650 cells. Great that we have the option of both. I wish I could have picked them up in the store the other day, I think they will be perfectly balanced tools.

I’d like to see jimbo do up a video on these

Well Finally found a HD that has the new m12 in stock, contrary to what the internet says, and in the hood of all places. Picked up the combo kit. I’ll take back my ugly comment from earlier, these are good looking tools and I was a bit skeptical at first about the grip but once I held them they actually feel real good in the hand.  These are my first 12 volt tools so ill

post more after I get a chance to play around with them.

Anyone know if the torque settings on the m12 drill translates directly to the same torque settings on the m18 fuel drill?

example: I frequently use the #2 torque setting on my m18 drill, but since the m12 has less power will I have to up the torque setting to say #5 or 6?

AnonymousJoe wrote:

On 2/17/2018 at 4:13 PM, AnonymousJoe said:

Well Finally found a HD that has the new m12 in stock, contrary to what the internet says, and in the hood of all places. Picked up the combo kit. I’ll take back my ugly comment from earlier, these are good looking tools and I was a bit skeptical at first about the grip but once I held them they actually feel real good in the hand.  These are my first 12 volt tools so ill

post more after I get a chance to play around with them.

 

Anyone know if the torque settings on the m12 drill translates directly to the same torque settings on the m18 fuel drill?

example: I frequently use the #2 torque setting on my m18 drill, but since the m12 has less power will I have to up the torque setting to say #5 or 6?

Congrats, They’re great tools and I really enjoy the kit I bought recently.