How to read a tape measure

I can’t believe this really needs so much explaining:

Who doesn’t know how to use a ruler?  But the comments are filled with “Oh thank you, this was so confusing before,” and there are oodles of such videos.

I was at least expecting him to explain why the hook is loosely attached and why the multiples of 16 are in red.  Those are pretty basic things too, but no, he spends the whole video, almost 9 minutes, just on explaining the 1/16″ markings.

If you need to know how to read a tape measure then you shouldn’t be doing anything that involves a tape measure. For Pete’s sake, we learn how to use rulers in 2nd grade, a tape measure is the same damned thing.

You would be surprised. First day of both engineering drawing and metal shop was spent explaining the same thing. It was followed by a test that was a picture of a section of tape with highlighted marks that you had to write down the measurement for. I thought the whole day was a joke untill about 40% of the class failed on the first try. You don’t realize how little some people have dealt with tapes when you were out there running a tape from the moment you could speak in sentences. I honestly think tape measures are the only reason I did well in math classes. 

Those damn fractions !!!

For this particular video, maybe the key is in the title: “How to read an American tape measure.”  Perhaps the people who need all this help were raised on the metric system and aren’t used to thinking of measurements in terms of repeated halving.  What’s half of half a centimeter?  2.5mm, but there’s no mark on a metric tape for that, and they wouldn’t think in those terms.

I’m comfortable with either system.  I appreciate the metric system for its easy calculations and conversions, but I think the American system is more lined up with human scale measurements and the calculations that are native to the way our brains work.  You don’t say to someone, “Hey, gimme 5/10 of your candy bar.”  I don’t have a problem measuring, say, length in metric measurements, but since nobody uses decimeters, the increments in common use are centimeters and meters, which is like giving the size of a room or the height of a person in half-inches or in yards with nothing between.  A foot is hard to divide by 5, but divides evenly by 2, 3, 4, or 6, whereas any metric increment really only divides evenly by 2 or 5.  So I think the American system has the advantage in divisibility at least.

dwasifar wrote:

For this particular video, maybe the key is in the title: “How to read an American tape measure.”  Perhaps the people who need all this help were raised on the metric system and aren’t used to thinking of measurements in terms of repeated halving.  What’s half of half a centimeter?  2.5mm, but there’s no mark on a metric tape for that, and they wouldn’t think in those terms.

 

I’m comfortable with either system.  I appreciate the metric system for its easy calculations and conversions, but I think the American system is more lined up with human scale measurements and the calculations that are native to the way our brains work.  You don’t say to someone, “Hey, gimme 5/10 of your candy bar.”  I don’t have a problem measuring, say, length in metric measurements, but since nobody uses decimeters, the increments in common use are centimeters and meters, which is like giving the size of a room or the height of a person in half-inches or in yards with nothing between.  A foot is hard to divide by 5, but divides evenly by 2, 3, 4, or 6, whereas any metric increment really only divides evenly by 2 or 5.  So I think the American system has the advantage in divisibility at least.

 

 

In practice the material measurement debate is pretty much moot; you use the system that’s dominant in your region, because those are the dimensions your materials come in.  We tend to prefer the system we’re comfortable with, which makes it hard to be objective.

I don’t think either system is inherently more precise.  You can measure anything with either scale, it’s just a matter of how small an increment you have to choose to match the length you want.  1/32″ is 794µm (microns to us, micrometres to the rest of the world), or about 0.8mm, which seems like an inherently imprecise conversion, but it looks as messy the other way; 1mm is about 5/128″.

I’ll make an exception to that statement for temperature, though, just because outside of science it’s rare to see temperature expressed in fractional degrees.  Common use (weather reports, thermostats, etc.) is to express temperature in one-degree increments, which makes Fahrenheit’s smaller degrees superior to Celsius.  Dividing the temperature difference between the boiling and freezing points of water into 100 increments seems kind of arbitrary; they’d have been better off choosing some other benchmarks, or dividing it into 200 increments instead for smaller, more precise degrees.

Once I got in a debate about this with a Russian woman, a co-worker.  I explained my point of view about human-scale increments and divisibility, and she pooh-poohed my arguments (as metric advocates tend to do).  “You just say that because you don’t know the metric system.”  I told her I know the metric system just fine.  “Oh really?  Then how tall am I, in metric measurements?”  She stood there looking smug; I looked her up and down and said, “About 170cm.”  Her face fell.  I said, “I’m right, aren’t I?”  “Well, we wouldn’t say it that way, but yes.  Why do men win all the arguments?”  I said, “Is that the way it is where you come from?” 🙂

haha I had a 4th year apprentice seriously ask how many 16ths in an inch?I looked at him for a second to look puzzled and said all of them and walked away….. 

comp56 wrote:

50 minutes ago, comp56 said:

haha I had a 4th year apprentice seriously ask how many 16ths in an inch?I looked at him for a second to look puzzled and said all of them and walked away….. 

should have told him 32 halves

comp56 wrote:

1 hour ago, comp56 said:

haha I had a 4th year apprentice seriously ask how many 16ths in an inch?I looked at him for a second to look puzzled and said all of them and walked away….. 

FOURTH year?  How did he get that far?

dwasifar wrote:

Just now, dwasifar said:

 

FOURTH year?  How did he get that far?

exactly……he didn’t last a week……..

Speaking of Tape measures, anyone have one of these? https://www.amazon.com/QUICKDRAW-Self-Marking-Foot-Measure/dp/B01ECKOWQQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1462945286&sr=8-1&keywords=tape+measure

[External image (images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com), not copied]

Looks like just another gimmick to me.

Claeg wrote:

2 hours ago, Claeg said:

Speaking of Tape measures, anyone have one of these? https://www.amazon.com/QUICKDRAW-Self-Marking-Foot-Measure/dp/B01ECKOWQQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1462945286&sr=8-1&keywords=tape+measure

 

[External image (images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com), not copied]

That picture makes better sense when you read the instructions and realize that what appears to be a skinny black rod sticking out of the side is actually intended to be a line drawn on the workpiece by the tool.

Yeah, I don’t think I’d use this.  If I’m marking something, I’m usually making more than one mark; drawing the tape out and make all the marks in one pass.  This would make you adjust the tape for each mark, and you’d have to line up your sight exactly with the line on the tape and lock it without shifting the tape.  I agree with albert; gimmick.

9 minute video I didn’t think anyone needed that much for reading a tape 

Logan wrote:

8 minutes ago, Logan said:

9 minute video I didn’t think anyone needed that much for reading a tape 

maybe the guy is a teacher at pre-school cause that is what that video made me feel….

3:58 on video I got a kick out of what he says, “It’s gonna take awhile, most tape measures” Most tape measures? ya be careful some have no marks at all….lol

JimboS1ice wrote:

should have told him 32 halves

tcoscarelli wrote:

2 hours ago, tcoscarelli said:

I love screwing with people by saying 16/32 or 6/4 or 6/16. On second thought, maybe I’m just an asshole.


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Sometimes I’ll screw with a guy here and switch between metric and standard, as I have a tape that has both systems on it. He hates it lol

KnarlyCarl wrote:

Sometimes I’ll screw with a guy here and switch between metric and standard, as I have a tape that has both systems on it. He hates it lol

tcoscarelli wrote:

3 minutes ago, tcoscarelli said:

Almost everything at my work is in metric. It is funny watching newbs learning it. We where all there once and had a guy training/screwing with us wile we learned. I’m just glad to fill that role.


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Metric is so easy though!!

Half of 16mm us much easier than half of 7 3/8

JimboS1ice wrote:

Metric is so easy though!!

 

Half of 16mm us much easier than half of 7 3/8

JimboS1ice wrote:

Metric is so easy though!!

 

Half of 16mm us much easier than half of 7 3/8

albert.amantea wrote:

On 2017-01-03 at 9:37 PM, albert.amantea said:

So, how big is “a bite”? emoji16.pngemoji16.pngemoji16.pngemoji16.pngemoji16.png

I agree with your statement though.

For some reason, the world outside the USA and Canada (some parts) has accepted that the metric system is much more precise (it’s not) and easier (maybe if you never used fractions)….

The metric system has only the equivalent of the 1/16″ (mm) but misses out completely when you move down to a 1/32″ or a 1/64″…

I personally can’t find the precision in metric for the work that I want to do or the signature I want to leave…

When I need true precision, I will go decimal with my measurements, but a 1/64″ or 1/32″ is plenty accurate for most woodworking and fine furniture projects.

Except the metric system scales linearly instead of having arbitrary fractions. 12″ in a foot. Whatever fraction you pull out of your lowest common denominator. Just like ounces pints and gallons. Or oz and lbs. Random scales with no common meaning. Metric everything just goes by 10/100/1000. Simple.

My biggest problem is as a Canadian we are “officially metric” but have only been that way for 50 years; not enough time for the old timers to kick the habit lol. Plus working construction and dealing with Americans means imperial crap everywhere. 

I know both like the back of my hand, pretty much no difference to me. 12″ 30cm 

my 3 grown kids on the other hand are 100% metric, so I like throwing grab me that yard stick or you need to add 3 cups of water….

Bremon wrote:

Except the metric system scales linearly instead of having arbitrary fractions. 12″ in a foot. Whatever fraction you pull out of your lowest common denominator. Just like ounces pints and gallons. Or oz and lbs. Random scales with no common meaning. Metric everything just goes by 10/100/1000. Simple.

 

My biggest problem is as a Canadian we are “officially metric” but have only been that way for 50 years; not enough time for the old timers to kick the habit lol. Plus working construction and dealing with Americans means imperial crap everywhere. 

There are measurements smaller than mm in metric. I don’t see how fractions are any more or less accurate than that. This is coming from someone who uses imperial at work exclusively. My tape measures don’t have 32nds on them but they do have mm. Which is more accurate on an average tape measure; 25 increments or 16?

Imperial being used still is more or more or less because USA is a massive country of people and square miles so changing everything over is a pain the the backside. To say nothing of the quality of education in America, or the general attitude of American exceptionalism towards doing something first or not doing it at all 😆

That said, Fahrenheit is infinitely preferable to Celsius. C is simple though. -40 is too damn cold. 0 is acceptable cold. 40 is too damn hot. 

Albert, I generally agree with you, but I have to differ about the origin of the foot measurement.  Almost nobody’s foot is actually a foot long unless they play in the NBA.  I wear a size 12 shoe, and my SHOES are a foot long, which is handy for pacing off rough distances, but my feet are obviously not as long as my shoes.  

Neither system is more accurate.  Any quantity can be expressed with any desired degree of precision in either system.  The debate is really about which is easier and more convenient, and each has its benefits and drawbacks in that regard. I think the human measurement argument weighs strongly in favor of the Imperial system, while the math argument leans in favor of metric.  So I’m tired of hearing from metric advocates about how stupid and inefficient Imperial measurements are, but I acknowledge it would also be wrong to take the opposite position.

dwasifar wrote:

Albert, I generally agree with you, but I have to differ about the origin of the foot measurement.  Almost nobody’s foot is actually a foot long unless they play in the NBA.  I wear a size 12 shoe, and my SHOES are a foot long, which is handy for pacing off rough distances, but my feet are obviously not as long as my shoes.  

 

Neither system is more accurate.  Any quantity can be expressed with any desired degree of precision in either system.  The debate is really about which is easier and more convenient, and each has its benefits and drawbacks in that regard. I think the human measurement argument weighs strongly in favor of the Imperial system, while the math argument leans in favor of metric.  So I’m tired of hearing from metric advocates about how stupid and inefficient Imperial measurements are, but I acknowledge it would also be wrong to take the opposite position.

albert.amantea wrote:

1 hour ago, albert.amantea said:

Well, thank you! I do agree that the foot measurement is likely way off, but that result was from Wikipedia and Google. While not perfect, they are generally correct, which is why I included the Google reference in my post.

I also agree that it truly doesn’t matter which system is used as long as the accuracy of the measurement is within the needed tolerance of the design. As stated, I use both on a daily basis and even mix the two within the same project quite often.

My issue with the previous post was that imperial was an arbitrary system, which is quite simply not true. It goes back to a time before metric, before even rulers and tape measures were common place. The inch measure was simply the length of the index finger from the tip to the first knuckle. If you Christian, you may remember the term “cubit” from the story of Noah’s Ark. This measurement was likely the distance from the elbow to the tip of the pinky finger.

My belief is that the foot measurement was probably the distance from the elbow to the wrist, but I have no proof or reliable science to back that up. It just makes since to me.

The “yard” measurement is said to be from tip of the nose to the outstretched middle finger, but I believe it is the length of an average human walking stride.

The historical aspect of this debate is very interesting to me, but it really doesn’t matter which one is used.

We are in agreement. 🙂

“When I need true precision, I will go decimal with my measurements, but a 1/64″ or 1/32″ is plenty accurate for most woodworking and fine furniture projects.”

•  That pretty much says in all. Decimal is the way to go. The US is pretty much the only place left that uses fractions and not the metric system. So that would explain why it is being pushed. 

Bremon wrote:

20 hours ago, Bremon said:

…-40 is too damn cold…

Not to mention the fact that if it’s -40° it doesn’t matter if it’s F or C!?

So true wild! 

@albert.amantea I think we can agree that obviously the standards for imperial have a reason for being. My point is those reasons are outdated. They are fairly arbitrary in today’s world. My work boot is a foot. That doesn’t make it a good scale for measurement. My feet are different sizes than many other people’s. The length of my finger from tip to first knuckle may be an inch; but if it is, that means many other people’s built-in tape measures were marked wrong at the factory.

As mentioned, I use both systems extensively. If you could expand on “Metric is simple to you because it doesn’t require thought. That doesn’t make it more accurate. In fact, it can make it less so.” I’d be all ears. It’s not simpler “to me”. It isn’t subjectively simpler; it’s objectively simpler. 

“Keep it simple, stupid” is a fairly common sentiment for a reason. How does simplicity take away from accuracy, bearing in mind metric has decimals? Especially when you’ve admitted you switch to decimal if you want perfection. 

I’m a duodecimalist at heart and so inches and feet make more sense to me. It is way easier to divide fractions than numbers for me anyway. That and you don’t even really speak in terms of feet most of the time when framing or most work. It’s almost always in terms of inches.

Bremon wrote:

So true wild! 

 

@albert.amantea I think we can agree that obviously the standards for imperial have a reason for being. My point is those reasons are outdated. They are fairly arbitrary in today’s world. My work boot is a foot. That doesn’t make it a good scale for measurement. My feet are different sizes than many other people’s. The length of my finger from tip to first knuckle may be an inch; but if it is, that means many other people’s built-in tape measures were marked wrong at the factory.

 

As mentioned, I use both systems extensively. If you could expand on “Metric is simple to you because it doesn’t require thought. That doesn’t make it more accurate. In fact, it can make it less so.” I’d be all ears. It’s not simpler “to me”. It isn’t subjectively simpler; it’s objectively simpler. 

 

“Keep it simple, stupid” is a fairly common sentiment for a reason. How does simplicity take away from accuracy, bearing in mind metric has decimals? Especially when you’ve admitted you switch to decimal if you want perfection. 

Imperial has decimals also. And I use them when I want precision and accuracy.

In order to gain simplicity, something has to give. In almost every case, the tradeoff is accuracy.

There is a huge difference between accuracy and precision. They are NOT the same thing, even though the terms are sometimes used interchangeably. (a pet peeve of mine)

Let me illustrate this for you…

Let’s say I am shooting a gun, firing 3 rounds 200 yards/meters down range at a bullseye target.

If I completely missed the target, but all 3 rounds hit with 1 inch/cm of each other, my precision is spot on, but my accuracy is worthless.

If all 3 rounds hit the target, but miss the bullseye and spread out by 6 inches /cm, my accuracy is much better, but my precision is worthless.

All 3 hitting the bullseye on the target within a 1 inch/cm spread would be both accurate and precise.

In other words, accuracy is accomplishing the goal intended…

Precision is doing something that is repeatable and reproducible.

Now, back to the discussion…

Your statement of imperial standards being outdated I think is a generalization. As long as you and I are human and physical beings, I don’t think it’s outdated.

All measurements either taken or given are relative and dynamic anyway. The standard of measurement is only a reference. The part either fits or it doesn’t, and I actually try to measure with rulers or tapes as little as possible.

I find it quicker, more precise, and more accurate, to use the physical piece to cut to fit instead of trying to hit a mark on a tape.

Anyone who does woodworking or a construction related industry for a living probably does as well.

Science based industry, machinists, engineering, etc., however, rely on measurements for their precision. They mostly will work in decimal notation, whether imperial or metric based, due to the precision required for their products to function and live long, happy lives.

In our industry, that level of precision and accuracy just isn’t required. Wood is a constantly changing material. It moves in 3 dimensions, and is quite forgiving of inaccuracies in measurements (to a point).

If a table is 6 feet long or 2 meters long doesn’t make a difference to those who enjoy sitting at and eating on it.

In fact, you could have a 6ft long table, with a 1 meter leaf in the center, and it would still work. (of course, it would matter if one side of the leaf had dowels at 3 cm and the table had them at 3 inches, but I digress.)

You also stated that the standard doesn’t make it a good scale for measurement, but I submit that it does.

Everyone has a finger, knuckle, elbow, etc, and it only takes a few seconds to determine the comparison for the standards chosen. Either could be used.

Whether or not it is subjective or objective, it is all most certainly relative.

Think we have gone well beyond how to read a tape measure. Hahaha

Theultimatehic wrote:

Think we have gone well beyond how to read a tape measure. Hahaha

@albert.amantea you make some good points and I can appreciate your point of view.

Inch/foot etc. point of reference doesn’t make it accurate, knowing that my forearm is say 11″ is handy in that I know I only have to add an inch to it for a foot but the same “trick” could be applied to metric. 

albert.amantea wrote:

5 minutes ago, albert.amantea said:

Yeah we kinda left that behind a while ago!

Lol we have to go off the beaten path to keep discussion interesting. 

Stercorarius wrote:

I’m a duodecimalist at heart and so inches and feet make more sense to me. It is way easier to divide fractions than numbers for me anyway. That and you don’t even really speak in terms of feet most of the time when framing or most work. It’s almost always in terms of inches.

albert.amantea wrote:

On 1/5/2017 at 8:33 PM, albert.amantea said:

Yep. Of course.. Framers only think in 1/8ths if they’re good, 1/4’s if they’re not!

you mean .125 right?

Nordraw wrote:

you mean .125 right?

Lol! Mm or 1/8 depends if I’m on the clock or not 😆

metric is a base 10 system which means when converting to a different measurement all you gotta do is move the decimal to the left or right the correct amount of spaces. Seems fairly easy to me. ie: 1mm =.1cm. Milwaukee makes an imperial/metric tape for those who use both. I think my dad probably taught me how to read a tape when I was young. Anyone know how to use an architects scale? we use them to read house plans.

proper way to read a tape measure is in the vertical position with your left or right arm bent at approx. 30° head tilted towards tape measure readings. If this is not available I get someone else to get measurements…………

comp56 wrote:

proper way to read a tape measure is in the vertical position with your left or right arm bent at approx. 30° head tilted towards tape measure readings. If this is not available I get someone else to get measurements…………

comp56 wrote:

proper way to read a tape measure is in the vertical position with your left or right arm bent at approx. 30° head tilted towards tape measure readings. If this is not available I get someone else to get measurements…………

This is too deep to read right before bed….

Interesting tho!

For some reason it sticks in my head that I was told in school that a certain King declared the length of his foot to be called “foot” and the distance from the tip of his thumb to the first knuckle to be called “inch” …. But I couldn’t tell you if that was just a story from my eccentric history teacher Mr. Scott Heiney or from the crazy old Mrs. Dana Souar just as a joke….

JimboS1ice wrote:

42 minutes ago, JimboS1ice said:

That tape better have the highest vertical reach and have been purchased with a 50% off coupon from apex tool group

Jimbo

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hmm if you post your personal email I could forward it to whoever is in charge of the 50% off coupons…..

KnarlyCarl wrote:

44 minutes ago, KnarlyCarl said:

This is too deep to read right before bed….

Interesting tho!

For some reason it sticks in my head that I was told in school that a certain King declared the length of his foot to be called “foot” and the distance from the tip of his thumb to the first knuckle to be called “inch” …. But I couldn’t tell you if that was just a story from my eccentric history teacher Mr. Scott Heiney or from the crazy old Mrs. Dana Souar just as a joke….

True, but interestingly enough they happen to be two different Kings, actually different Kings for all of them. The foot was King Charlemagne and the inch was King Edgar. Yard was King Henry I’s nose to his fingertip. Some of the measurements are said to have been modified to today’s numbers to better standardize them with other measurements. 

well if we are covering history, how long is a furlong?