Archived from the Tools In Action forum (Around The House). This thread is read-only.
The in-ground pool in my new-to-me southern Florida house is very nice. One REALLY nice aspect is the full screen enclosure. ALL my other pools were open to the outside, requiring continuous / ongoing maintenance to remove blown-in leaves and vegetation. The screening keeps things MUCH cleaner w/ MUCH less effort.
The pool has a vinyl liner, which is a first for me. All of my prior pools had the plaster Diamond Bright coating on the concrete interior surface. I really like the vinyl liner. It has a nice appearance. The potential downside is damage, such as from pet’s paws clawing to get out. Fortunately my grand dogs all swim to the reinforced plastic steps to exit, not attempting to get out on the side, so I should be good for this potential issue.
The pool / house has solar water heating panels on the roof, w/ automatic temperature control provided by a Pentair SolarTouch Solar Control System w/ an automatic motorized valve and temperature sensors. The previous owner had left me a custom-cut pool blanket / cover, folded inside the garage. When the ambient air temperature started dropping I installed the cover on the pool and decided a nice pool cover reel would work better for me to install / replace the cover for usage / idle time. It has wheels to permit relocating this large / heavy reel when not required during warm / hot weather.
There is also a nice Hayward AquaRite salt system chlorinator. These are terrific and result in a huge cost / time savings when compared to options like floating tabs. MUCH less chemicals are required when using a salt system.
The pool isn’t setup to drain water, when rain fills it up too high (VERY common occurrence during the rainy season). A garden hose, even w/ a pump is waaay too slow, so the method I use is to turn off the salt system, detach the plumbed inline salt system chlorine-generating fuel cell by unscrewing the union fittings, then turn on the pump to flood the area , then the driveway, w/ massive amounts of water being discharged from the pool. This method dumps MASSIVE amounts of water in minutes, instead of hours using a garden hose.
The ambient air temperature recently dropped here, so I started using the blanket and tweaking the timer to insert the most photons possible into the water.
One morning I observed the system determined there was heat on the roof (visually indicated by the controlled valve position), but the pump wasn’t scheduled to turn on for a few minutes, so I flipped it on manually. When I came back out of the garage I was greeted w/ a cloud of electrical smoke from the pump having burned up, so I turned the motor off.
Not sure if I should be mad at the US federal government, or Hayward, the pump manufacturer, but the plain motor high horsepower pool pumps are no longer available from Hayward. My VERY STRONG preference is a simple on/off pump, w/o a computer and w/o electronics, all of which add cost, complexity and are THE EXPENSIVE PART that will fail in the future. I’m VERY unhappy that it is IMPOSSIBLE to purchase the pump w/ a plain motor from Hayward. I REQUIRE a high horsepower pump to send water up to the roof before going to the pool. Instead the ONLY Hayward option on the high horsepower pool pumps is to select a high-efficiency variable-speed pump w/ an internal computer, so I was forced to select this TriStar XE 2¼hp pool pump. On the plus side it is possible to configure this to run at full speed once power is applied using the single illuminated pushbutton menu configuration. Note there ARE some inexpensive high horsepower Chinese pumps available, but I couldn’t bring myself to installing one of those on my house.
Of course, the different pump required changes to the Schedule 40 PVC plumbing, grrr. My experience is that long-term exposure to intense Florida sunshine causes the plastic to shatter when attempting to cut, so I lifted the nearby walkway pavers, made all the plumbing cuts underground and discarded / replaced the pipes and valves feeding the pump and on the output into the filter. For some reason I needed to use my shop vacuum to blow out the pipe to the skimmer pipe prior to cutting it, also needing to screw in a tall pipe at the pool to prevent draining. I REALLY didn’t want a deluge of pool water draining when I cut those pipes below ground. The other pipes blew out fine.
The pump and the filter now have union fittings right at those devices to permit “easy” device replacement in the future, if/when required, assuming the same pump is available in about five years when this one fails.
Once I pulled on that upgrade-the-pump thread I decided I didn’t like any of the wiring and the equipment placement at this location, so I ripped out everything, cleaned up everything and reinstalled it the way I like things done.
The prior installation had a cacophony of wires across the ground and air, mandating careful walking then standing when bending over and leaning to read / operate the displays and controls. None of the system boxes were grouped together. The existing rigid Schedule 80 electrical PVC conduits and flexible conduits were all crisscrossed on the ground, same also w/ the low voltage cables, making standing on wiring required for many operations.
All of the existing control boxes were removed, then cleaned from house paint. The house had old color ghost outlines where the equipment and conduits were previously attached. I filled all the old mounting holes w/ mortar and painted all the stucco to match the existing color.
The electrical and mechanical guts on the existing Intermatic 24 hour pool timer switch were in excellent condition, but the old style steel enclosure was in rough shape, so I sanded it to bare metal and repainted using Rust-Oleum High-Performance Spray Enamel before installing that refurbished timer. Now it looks brand new again.
Some of the 220 VAC wiring running through the rigid and flexible conduits was solid / single conductor wire. My preference is instead to use flexible stranded THHN wire within conduit, so I swapped all of that wiring to fresh tri-color 12 AWG black/white/green, w/ the white ends colored black to visually indicate line voltage, not neutral voltage.
The wiring requirements have changed / improved since the house was built. The house had just one ground rod for the 200A panel and I wanted to upgrade to the current standard of two rods, adding a 5/8” x 8’ copper grounding rod, electrically connected by bare 4 AWG stranded wire. At some point I will also swap the existing solid ground wire to 4 AWG stranded wire.
I decided to utilize this bare ground wire to provide a solid ground to the pool and the irrigation pump ground lugs w/ solid 8AWG green insulation wire and split bolts. I also ran my new cable service NEC 800.100 green ground wire directly to this new 4 AWG bonded ground rod. The pump ground lug was / is used for the three pool aluminum screen enclosure green ground wires.
Back in the dinosaur days I would tap this rod as far as possible into the ground using a sledge hammer. Now I just put my TEMCo Industrial TH0376 5/8” Bore SDS Max Ground Rod Driver bit onto my Bosch RH540M SDS-Max demolition hammer and it is easy peasy to drive the rod to the desired depth. One cool aspect is the rod’s drive end looks pristine when complete, instead of mushroomed over from sledge hammer tapping. My selection for this particular rod is just below ground level, in the nearby rock mulch bed. I just needed to select a location where I wouldn’t hit any of the stuff buried in that area. There are LOTS of underground pipes / conduits for the water main, irrigation pipes and the EMT feeding the detached garage sub panel.
All of the control boxes are now attached to the house, at a height where the displays / controls can be read and accessed while properly standing w/ the existing pumps and pipes in the area. All of the pool stuff are now grouped together. All of the irrigation stuff are now grouped together at a different place.
All of the high and low voltage wires are routed within Schedule 80 EMT conduit, secured to the wall w/ one hole clamps and Tapcon screws, at sequentially higher placement, except the new bare copper ground wire in the bottom corner isn’t in a conduit. There were / are LOTS of low voltage wires for the solar system and the salt system that were a mess on the ground and across the air, now all are cleaned up / routed / stored nicely. The extra length for the motorized solar valve, w/ a connector on the end, is now tucked away nicely within the solar control box for a clean appearance.
One of the changes shown is removal / replacement of the two nearby buried irrigation valve boxes. It was required to swap the incoming valve control wire, because the controller box was moved to the far wall, mandating a longer wire piece (fortunately had a leftover piece of sufficient length on-hand from a prior project). My preference for these flush ground boxes is to have the bottom be clean rock mulch instead of filled w/ dirt. I had 10 gallons of clean white coral rock, scavenged from a different project that I used here. The large rectangular box consumed 5 gallons, the small round one another 1-2 gallons.
Some of the images show temporary labels made w/ blue painter’s tape and a Sharpie. All of those have since been replaced w/ labels printed from my dinosaur Brady IDXPERT Label Printer.
The BIG time suck was excavating and screening the rock mulch, prior to replacing the clean rock mulch onto the new weed tarp. This is a long rock mulch bed and I did the near half, filling 16 five gallon buckets w/ screened clean rock mulch awaiting replacement. Also painted the bottom edge of the house while the ground was excavated low.
One thing that still seems off is the incoming City water main, running for about 12’ across the slab, above ground as Schedule 40 PVC pipe.
The finished result is exactly what I had hoped to attain.
Enclosed Swimming Pool and Cover Reel
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Prior Plumbing and Wiring Configuration
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Prior Plumbing Configuration w/ Salt System Fuel Cell Removed to Dump Excess Water
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Wall Ghost Outlines After Removal of Boxes and After Mounting Holes Filled w/ Mortar
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Mechanical Timer Box – Before / After Refinishing, Then Wired
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Prior Pump Plumbing w/ Pavers Removed
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Pool Skimmer w/ Temporary Pipe Screwed Into Fitting, Permitting Water to be Blown Out
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New Plumbing Input Pipes
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New Pump Plumbing
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Zone Valve Boxes – Before and After Installing Clean Rock Mulch on Bottom
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New Wiring Installation
New Pool Pump Wiring
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New Sprinkler / Irrigation System Wiring
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New Electrical Conduits
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New Low Voltage Wiring
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Driving New / Additional Ground Rod
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Screening Rock Mulch
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Adding Weed Tarp and Replacing Clean Rock Mulch
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Wow, that is a nice set up with the pool area, that looks really nice. In regards to the work, nice job. I like how everything looks so clean, nice job.
Thanks much.
One of the things I really like about the pool is the fully programmable LED light string I added to the screen enclosure.
The string includes a remote control for basic functions, but this LED light string really shines when using the iPhone application.
There are ~50 pre-programmed / selectable LED sequences available in the phone application, or it is possible to create your own.
It is possible to program the color, intensity and sequence speed.
The application also permits automatic selection of the color show synchronized to the the music coming through the phone.
I installed this onto my daughter’s house, really liked it and then got it for my home.
It took several hours to screw it into my daughter’s wooden eves.
It took several days to screw it into my aluminum frame. (I wasn’t counting on that extra time / effort).
These are set to automatically turn on / off at preselected times. It continues w/ the last lighting program that had been running. It will default to ON when power is restored after an outage.
Really, really, really like these lights at the pool. (My neighbor spotted them and purchased it for her home.)
A still photo doesn’t scratch the surface on how nice these are in-action.
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Oh wow, that is awesome. Brings it up to a new level. Something about having the right lighting can make all the difference. Nice job.
My pool has a solar water heating system, w/ twelve Solar Hydronics Corporation HT412 4′ x 12′ solar panels controlled by a Pentair SolarTouch Controller.
This is a very nice setup, all automatic, w/ easy to modify setpoint temperatures.
One interesting feature is that it may be setup for cooling, in the middle of the summer, by running the pump at night, setting the controller for cool and using the roof panels as radiators to dissipate heat.
Not long ago I noticed the roof panels were slowly leaking pool water. On dry days, when the pump and solar heater were running, I noticed some water coming down the rain gutter. I also noticed the pool level dropping slightly.
The panels are interconnected w/ hoses and clamps. I went on the roof and hoped to fix the problem by tightening the clamps. They were already fully tight and I also noted panel leaks. Turns out I had six leaks.
The panel manufacturer was contacted. They informed me that special sized screws are used to plug the leaks. The leaking pipe galley is cut and those screws used to plug the openings.
The installer (from seven years earlier on the previous owner) was contacted and provided an expensive repair cost and not immediately available. A different company was contacted, arrived the next day and provided a VERY reasonable repair cost.
That solar panel installer also told me the metal roof w/ protruding screws are problematic for solar panels. The normal thermal expansion / contraction causes abrasion / leaks. He offered to remove the twelve panels, install old panels between those active panels and the roof to act as a blanket to protect backside from screw abrasion / leak potential, also at a reasonable cost. I opted to have him add those “blankets”. Turns out none of these existing leaks were caused by screw abrasion.
After the service, all was good for several weeks, then the controller complained about a roof temperature sensor short and stopped working. The Pentair SolarTouch controller uses two 10K Ohm thermistor sensors, one to measure water temperature, w/ a probe inserted into a hole in the pipe plumbing, the other to measure roof temperature, w/ a sensor attached near the panels. A temporary solution was implemented, replacing the shorted roof temperature sensor wiring w/ a 1,500 Ohm ¼ watt resistor, to fool the controller into thinking there was 166°F heat on the roof, so it would work until I finished the repair.
The wiring resistance was measured and a short was verified. It turns out the system was installed using interior wiring run across the southern Florida roof and the intense sunshine deteriorated the insulation. The blanket installation pinched the wiring at several places. The wiring was originally loose, just laying on the roof, from one end of my hose to the other. (The installer also used interior wire nuts on both sensors.)
The wiring was replaced w/ sunlight resistant 16/2 wire. A new Pentair 522101 solar sensor was installed. The staggered joint soldered wires were insulated w/ adhesive heat shrink tubing as was the wire jacket. The wire gauge is a little too thick for the controller PCB receptacle, so I snipped away several conductor strands at that point. The wire strands are bare (not tinned) copper, so long-term oxidation is possible. The house isn’t near salt water, so I’m pretty sure it will outlast me (my new criteria).
The solar panels are connected to the pool plumbing 2″ black PVC pipes that are retained to the roof / house w/ screwed formed metal U straps. There is room within those straps for the wiring. I cut braided vinyl tubing segments, jammed those tightly into the gap between the pipe and the straps and ran the new wire across the roof, from the sensor to the controller, now retained instead of loose.
Pentair SolarTouch Controller Detected Short Circuit
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Pentair Normal Sensor Wiring
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Pentair Fooled w/ 1.5K Ohm ¼ Watt Resistor Instead of 10K Ohm Thermistor Roof Sensor
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House and Screened Pool w/ Twelve Solar Roof Panels
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Solar Panels
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Solar Panel Leak
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Old Deteriorated Sensor and Wiring
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New Sensor Wiring
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I would be so lost if I had to figure this out. The whole project looks awesome. I would be the guy who would enjoy every moment in the pool, but wouldn’t know the first thing on how to fix anything there, lol.
Thanks. I’m the opposite. I’d have been happy without a pool. My pool usage is when company arrives. It’s LOTS of effort, cost and a HUGE chemistry experiment.
LOL. That’s usually how it goes. It’s like owning a pool table. You play it for a week and then it sits there. Kind of like my workout machine. It was great for a week, not the cloths hang on it. However a pool is a lot more work.